Patterson Thoughts?

So, I've been riding my Rover NuVinci a while now, (just replaced the tires), and I was thinking about ways to slightly increase both the top speed and the hill climbing ability, by a small margin, without going bankrupt in the process.  I saw a few earlier posts which mentioned the Patterson Transmission Crankset, and wondered if this would work on a NuVinci.

I've already flipped my Rover once, so I'm not looking to turn it into a race bike, though a few extra miles per hour would be welcome, as would a moderate improvement in climbing hills.  I went to the Patterson website, and they don't really explain how their drive works, at least not to a degree that I could understand.  If there are two ring gears hidden inside the crankset, would this cause chain length issues?  Is the gear range, (is that the right word?), compatible with acquiring a slightly higher top end, and slightly slower low end?

I'm not an expert on bike stuff, by any definition, so I hope my question makes sense.
If I've made any blatant engineering errors with my inquiry, I welcome any wisdom which would help set me straight.

-Sean

Comments

  • The Patterson crank is an internally geared crank, similar to your internally geared hub. The chain length wouldn't change providing the crank ring stays the same. The gear range would change to the equivalent of having a 28 tooth and a 45 tooth chain ring on the crank. If you currently have a 32 tooth ring on the crank the Patterson would give you a lower low and a higher high gear.
  • Lets say you have a 32 tooth sprocket on the front and a 16 tooth sprocket on the rear and no gearing. For each rotation of the front sprocket the rear rotates twice. Now change to the Patterson and in low you would have 28-16 which would be one rotation of the front sprocket and 1.75 rotations of the rear sprocket giving you a better hill climbing experience. Then in high gear you would have 45-16 which would be one rotation of the front sprocket and 2.8125 rotations of the rear sprocket giving you a faster top speed.
  • But of course doing the post, double ring, derailleur route is a bit of a hassle
  • You're correct @elrique64, but I was merely speaking to the rotations of the sprockets, then the rear internal gearing comes into affect. It also matters not where 1:1 is since the example works all the way through the gear range, not just at 1:1. The Patterson will increase and decrease the entire gear range by the same amount. My example was to show the OP how the Patterson would work, to as the he put it, "slightly increase both the top speed and the hill climbing ability, by a small margin".
  • I have a rover with a NuVinci 360 I installed aftermarket and a Patterson It works great. I also have a Rover with a paterson and a 11  to 34 ext. I have more range both ways on both trikes thanks to the paterson. I would recomend the upgrade if you have the coin
  • edited December 2016
    And it probably should be mentioned that if you put on a Patterson or a Schlumpf crank, you no longer have the option of putting an electric assist crank motor on without removing, and no longer using, your Patterson or Schlumpf drive. Whereas putting a double or triple sprocket up front, some sort of chain gobbler or tensioner, would cost you less than 1/2 the investment of the Patterson and 1/4 that of the Schlumpf. This should let you fairly inexpensively experiment with a lower low and higher high to see if it gets you what you want.

    While you will not be able to use the double or triple sprocket if you decide to add an electric assist crank motor, you can continue to use the chain gobbler/tensioner and now have the option of moving the boom in or out (perhaps to let someone of a different size try the trike) without sizing issues. Then, if you decide you want a Patterson or a  Schlumpf, all you have that you can't continue to ues is the double or triple front sprocket! Using the triple or double is the easiest and least expensive way to try higher high gears and lower low gears. And it is a minimal investment (comparatively). I hope this helps.

    Of course there are other electric assist options other than a crank motor, but I think (IMHO) the crank motor is probably best suited as an electric assist for a NuVinci hub trike.

    But, like you, I am no expert... in fact, I have no direct experience with a Patterson, Schlumpf, NuVinci, or even electric assist motors (other than the Bafang BBSHD which is in a box set to be installed on my Rover next month). So I hope the info I have above is correct. And I encourage those of you with experience (i.e. jamesrelrique64, etc.) with any, and perhaps all, of these, to correct any of my potential misgivings.
  • @jamesr a pair of those on the front and snow tires..... I could plow my driveway on my rover. :D
  • edited December 2016
    My opinion. Once you put a motor on a HPV used for exercise you might as well be on this. http://www.discovermymobility.com/store/scooters/ewheels-scooters/ew-36-scooter/ew-36.jpg?vm=r
  • Twin synchronized Hub motor, front wheel drive and no parasite sprocket and chain drag. What is wrong with that ? Price sure but typically that comes down some with volume. 


  • lol love how this thread got derailed.
  • @Elrique64 please, take a breath. He's not in your situation, and may not find it easy to imagine himself in it.

    He made an offhand foolish statement. Judgmental, even. But who among us hasn't stuck our foot in our mouth at one point or another? I think I've used my own foot for mouthwash many times.

    To each his own. Your motor makes your life possible, even to extending it. Don't place such weight on another's word when he's not in your shoes. Forgive those who speak too quickly or without thought.
  • Sad that a person gets angry over a comment about recumbent trikes on a site populated mostly by senior citizens staying active.
  • Exercise/activity is exercise/activity whether assisted or not. In a gym environment, assist would be downright silly because you're not going anywhere.  Real life is different. 

    In real life: 
    you may need to get to places
    you may have limited time to do so
    you may be forced to take a route you normally wouldn't, which has steeper hills than you can normally take
    you may get injured far from other transportation and *have* to keep riding
    you may have stretches where you need to keep up speed due for safety in traffic
    you might suddenly lose energy or your normal ability to pedal, but still need to get back home on your own
    you may be riding for enjoyment, not maximal exercise benefit

    along with a host of other differences.

    Some people use motor assist so that they can still get to work on time without being too sweaty. Can anyone honestly say they're better off continuing to drive or take public trans? Or there's no benefit at all to riding instead?

    Some of us are significantly disabled in non-uniformed ways, where we can't fully predict how we'll be in an hour or two. Or are prone to sudden unpredictable lapses in health. For some of us assist is the difference between riding or not riding. For others it gives them a couple more years of riding before they have to stop altogether. Blanket statements that X is dumb or useless runs the risk (however unintentional) of belittling those who like or need X.


    - PaulNM
       
  • edited December 2016
    There is a guy I ride with occasionally that is on a fully motorized rover due to extreme weakness caused by nerve damage in a motorcycle accident. He can stand and walk twenty feet or so but that is it. He cannot pedal for more than a minute or so.

    We usually meet up on a roadway in our local park me on my DF him on his Rover and we ride 15-20 miles. Just the chance to put his face in the wind again has done wonders for his mental health. The deeply BS laden conversations we have while riding are good for both of us. I ride with many people of various abilities and commitment and all of them are seeking the same thing friendship, face in the wind, and exercise either physical or mental.

    So I say ride on in whatever style you can and enjoy. 
  • If his feet are properly attached to the pedals, he is still exercising his leg muscles.  It's no different than the CPM machines I used after my surgeries.   

    I don't need a motor on these flatlands but I am open to getting one in the future.  You never know!
  •   I'd like to get an electric assist *if* I knew how to do it and could afford it. Them hills kill my legs and having an Electric Jesus to give me a push would be a TREMENDOUS help!

      Although I cannot foresee myself going too fast as am not comfortable in the handling of the steering yet. But the assist on hills would be worth it, and just because *if* the electric assist was there I wouldn't have to use it - it be there when needed.
      At present, can barely afford what I've got and hoping the Rockhopper parts can swap over & it helps. Was hoping for more work from job #1 but unfortunately the government thinks we need less work in the winter months, which means I'm living on pb&j's to keep the trailer above freezing.
  • Don't forget beans and rice. Full of protein and carbs
  •   Do have some rice, and quinoa. Try to eat apples, and I swear bananas (even though are cheap) are fattening. Quinoa I got when was cooking with the GoSun Sport solar stove. Then this harsh winter landed and rarely a sight of Goo Ol' Sol.
  • You need bananas when you exercise for the potassium
  • You need a Franklin pot-belly stove and an axe :-)
  • No Way on the stove and axe. Probably whack off a toe. Then how would you pedal a Patterson?
  • I spent a Michigan winter in an off-grid cabin with just a pot belly franklin, an axe and a rifle. If @Idahotraillizard needs warmth for free, that's the way.

    Now you have to find somebody who wants to give up one for free
  • edited January 2017
    When I lived up by Riggins, ID had stayed in a cabin where the wood stove was the heat source. Do miss them good ol'days. Was healthier then, a firefighter, even fought wildland fires. But... To go riding was either uphill or downhill first, and the reverse coming back. Trike wise would definitely need a motor, or tease mountain lions in granny gear.
  • So keep the bang stick handy! Sheeth behind the seat?
  • quinoa?  might as well go out back and eat some twigs.  :)
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