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Suggestions please I want to upgrade from a Rover!

weldin4weldin4
in General Discussions
The two trikes I'm looking at are the Grand Tourismo 20, or the Rambler 30. I mainly ride on concrete trails and few occasions participate in over the road 20 - 40 mile bike ride events. I test rode a Rambler and like the solidness and the gearing. I have not been able to locate a grand tourismo locally yet. I would really like to test ride one before making the decision. My concern with the tourismo will it be fast enough being only 20 speed? I would like something faster option to keep up with the two wheelers on long rides. Also the rover creaks and moans at times I have to tighten the frame screws from time to time. Do the other trikes do this? Are the tube frames quite more so than the square frames? I'm a big guy so I need something to handle 275 lbs, 6' 4".
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Comments

  • chonkchonk
    Both are excellent choices and will work but I'm pretty smitten with the Gran Tourismo.
    image
    Jeff "Chonk" Yonker
    Marketing Dude @TerraTrike
    You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretsky
  • weldin4weldin4
    Will it be as fast as the 30 speed? or am I looking at this wrong?
  • GaryGary
    Between my wife's Rambler which I have ridden occasionally and a Gran Tourismo x20 I test rode, I would highly recommend the Gran Tourismo. The steering on the GT is smother, highly adjustable due to new bushing/ bearing design, the 24" rear wheel gives a better ride than the 20" on the Rambler and the trigger shifting on the GT is a great improvement over the standard twist shifting on the Rambler.

    I was seriously considering a new GT until I had my Path overhauled last month. Sticking with the Path for a while, but the GT is definitely in the back of my mind.
  • Florida_boundFlorida_bound
    weldin4, glad you mentioned the frame screws loosening. I have the same problem but believe it may be due to rocking my body while riding. If the seat had springs like a 2-wheeler, that would eliminate my problem.
  • weldin4weldin4
    Gary the Rambler 30 has trigger shifting. There are some hills where i ride nothing serious though. Won't the 24" wheel make it harder to climb? There is a difference in the frame. I know the GT is the latest and greatest design. I just want to be able to keep up with the 2 wheeler's on long rides. my concern is the GT won't be able to do that.
  • weldin4weldin4
    Florida_bound is this only an issue with the Rover or will it be an issue with all makes?
  • squirrelpie0squirrelpie0
    20 vs 30 speed has nothing to.do a top speed of bike. Look at the gear inches. A 20 sp could have exact top and low speed as 30. A 24 in rear wheel w 48t front will give you a top speed over 20 mph if you can pedal skustained that hard. Many 2 wheel travel faster .only way you will stay with them is prob eAssist. Try a Rambled EVO.
  • TCEdTCEd
    you may need an Etrike if you're thinking about keeping up with bicycles. A lot will have to do with physical condition of yourself and the riders your with.
  • Florida_boundFlorida_bound
    I've never ridden any other model so I don't know if the have this problem. I know the frame on several are round, not square. And, some don't have any kind of adjustment. The frame is one size and you have to buy the boom size you need.
  • mrbill5mrbill5
    Square versus round tubing has nothing to do with it. The round tube frames are all welded, basically one piece. The Rover is unique in that it is tubing inside tubing which gives you much higher weight bearing, more flexibility as far as changing it to a tandem and more frame flex because it is a sliding tube inside another tube held in place by bolts. I never saw a trike frame before like the Rover, tube inside tube. The square tube trike I built years ago was like every other one piece frame with the difference being the main tube was square instead of round. The main advantage to square tubes with cantilevered bottom brackets is the bottom bracket cannot twist. It can slide out due to peddling forces if not tightened enough but it cannot twist.
  • JamesRJamesR
    think you will have seat-squeak on any trike with an adjustable seat. on a rover, replacing the seat support grenade pins with bolts will stiffen the seat, adding a cargo rack will do even more so. i also used 1/4 threaded rod to tie the lower struts together.

    blue loctite on all threaded fasteners will help in maintaining seat rigidity.

    rambler squeaks less than rover but the seat-mount bolts loosen over time unless loctite is applied. as with rover, bolts instead of pins + cargo rack makes a difference. gran turismo [havent ridden one] is probably has the best seat stability in the terratrike lineup.
  • TrikeBirderTrikeBirder
    @weldin4 - I think you have unrealistic expectations equating more gears with more speed. While there is a relationship, adding more gears does not get you more speed. Rather, it gives you more "steps" between standing still and your top speed. Your top speed under pedal power is likely going to be about the same with a trike equipped with 20 speeds as the same trike equipped with 30 speeds all other things being equal.

    Under pedal power alone, your top speed will be more dependent on your organic motor, total weight of the trike, rolling resistance, and your gear inch range.

    Now, let's look at your stated goal "I just want to be able to keep up with the 2 wheeler's on long rides." That's going to be a problem unless you want to add an electric assist motor. Here are some reasons why. First, even if all other things were equal, you would still have 50% more wheels to propel along with a trike compared to a bike. That extra wheel has extra weight too, and extra frame parts which add even more weight.

    The average adult road bike weighs roughly 20#s. The average recumbent trike weighs close to 40#s. So, at twice the weight and 50% more wheel contact surface to propel, it is unrealistic to think you are going to keep up with guys probably half your age in probably better physical shape riding a 20 pound 2-wheeled vehicle.

    If you are willing to add electric assist to your trike, you might be able to keep up with most of them. I added an electric assist to my Rover last winter - a Bafang BBSHD from Luna Cycle. I love this motor, and it is FAST... dangerously FAST. I have managed to reach 30 mph with this setup, and Phil at Spin Bicycle has had my trike up to 34 mph. Thirty was way too fast. Twenty is probably as fast as I ever actually ride my trike, and then only for short distances on good non-busy trails.

    As for the new TT GT, while your thinking is correct that a 24" wheel in the back will make it harder to climb hills compared to the same trike with a smaller wheel. However, TT has designed and built the GT to handle hills with a 24" wheel and has geared it accordingly. If you buy another TerraTrike, I think the GT or the EVO would be a good choice. They both can accommodate a total of 300#s rider & accessories, and gear, so keep up the great work taking off weight.

    You might try doing some enhancements over the winter to your Rover (consider a triple crank up front or an electric assist motor), or do some enhancements to your organic motor (perhaps an indoor trainer like the Kinetic Fluid Trainer ~$300), or both!

    Best of luck with whatever you decide... keep us posted.
  • mrbill5mrbill5
    JamesR wrote: »
    think you will have seat-squeak on any trike with an adjustable seat. on a rover, replacing the seat support grenade pins with bolts will stiffen the seat, adding a cargo rack will do even more so. i also used 1/4 threaded rod to tie the lower struts together.

    blue loctite on all threaded fasteners will help in maintaining seat rigidity.

    rambler squeaks less than rover but the seat-mount bolts loosen over time unless loctite is applied. as with rover, bolts instead of pins + cargo rack makes a difference. gran turismo [havent ridden one] is probably has the best seat stability in the terratrike lineup.

    I did the threaded rod mod to my new Rover but the strut holes were more like 1/8". Did you drill out the strut holes to accept the larger 1/4" threaded stock?r6u70co4jtlj.jpeg
  • mrbill5mrbill5
    Trike birder
    Well said. Very true. In my prime 35 years ago I could average 20 mph for 50 miles. The local roadies would regularly leave me behind since they would average 23 to 25 mph. And they always dropped me on the hills since I suck at hill climbing.
  • JamesRJamesR
    any bike or trike, turning the cranks at 60 rpm, you need 113 gear-inches to do 20 mph. a 16-speed rover can cruise at that rate if equipped with a patterson crankset up front [$300] and a sturmey xrf8w hub in a 20-inch wheel [$300].

    with a 22-tooth sprocket on the sturmey, humble rover will have 24-124 gear-inches and none of the other steeds in the terratrike stable gonna whup you: x-20, x-30, 24-inch wheel, 26-inch wheel - dont matter.

    to figure speed: [gear-inches] x [rpm] x [.003]

    gran turismo is a pretty-looking thing, though
  • Florida_boundFlorida_bound
    What you have to understand is those road bikers won't want you riding with them. Your trike takes up too much room. They can't pass you when they want. They think you are old and decrepit because you ride a trike even though that may not be true at all. But, it is their opinion.

    A better option is to find a group of trike riders and start riding with them. Go to Trikegroups.com, join, and find riders near you. Believe me, you are so much better on a trike. Your butt doesn't hurt and the view is awesome!
  • mrbill5mrbill5
    The roadies do not want you around because they cannot get a draft off of you. Cannot recover while drafting until it is their turn to lead the pack.
  • Florida_boundFlorida_bound
    That's what they get for trying to ride so many miles. I don't need to draft or recover. And, I have a very enjoyable ride.
  • JamesRJamesR
    current discussion on bike and trike mix: https://www.bentrideronline.com/messageboard/showthread.php?t=137382
  • JamesRJamesR
    @mrbill5 - yeah, drilled tubes to 1/4 for rod insertion, double-nutted both sides of the seat struts.

    for a really stiff seat support, on my attempt at a longtail rover using the tandem extension, fitted 3/4 square aluminum tubing for the seat struts, cross-braced with threaded rod.

    later on, one of my used deltas came with a very squeaky seat. bolted the seat clamp and replaced the rusty seat struts with square aluminum tubing - magic fix!
  • mrbill5mrbill5
    JamesR wrote: »
    @mrbill5 - yeah, drilled tubes to 1/4 for rod insertion, double-nutted both sides of the seat struts.

    for a really stiff seat support, on my attempt at a longtail rover using the tandem extension, fitted 3/4 square aluminum tubing for the seat struts, cross-braced with threaded rod.

    later on, one of my used deltas came with a very squeaky seat. bolted the seat clamp and replaced the rusty seat struts with square aluminum tubing - magic fix!

    I can see replacing the struts in the future once I am locked in with the seat angles. I wish I still had access to the brazing torch I had in the past. I would silver braze an "h" out of 4130 steel with threaded ends. May need to visit the local hardware store and peruse the goods......
  • TCEdTCEd
    Group rides can be complicated at times. You're adjusting your pace to the groups slowest or fastest rider depending on the groups objectives and also face being dropped from the ride if you're slow. My wife does them frequently as she's always training for bicycling events and knows enough riders at her level which is very fast.

    I tend to ride alone although I do enjoy riding with others occasionally but conversation is limited, we usually enjoy the scenery and our own thoughts.
  • weldin4weldin4
    Thanks everyone for you input! Like I said not looking at keeping up with the fastest just not falling too far out of reach of the main pack. The bike events I attend are not races more or less charitable events for a good cause and stressed not a race but just for fun. I think a step up to the GT or the Rambler might be just enough speed to be where I want to be. Yes I'm no spring chicken and realize those days are in the past. I would love to have the EVO but that's out of my budget range. If the GT will match the same speed of the Rambler I believe the GT is the way to go. Sounds like TT has put all the latest and greatest design into it. Now if I can convince the wife to keep the rover for her and I'll buy the GT for me I'll hit the jackpot. Again, thank you all for helping me with this decision!
  • weldin4weldin4
    After thinking it through long and hard I decided not to sell my rover. I think I'll change out the front crankset to get my chain inches over a hundred, which should do the trick for the least amount of cost. I took my trike in to Richardson Bike Mart here in Richardson, Texas (these guys are really good at what they do here), for a tune up and they are going to see what options they have to get my chain inches over a hundred. I should know something this afternoon.
  • weldin4weldin4
    The creaking and noise was coming from the frame. The inner frame was not greased. They greased it up got it back no noise at all.
  • JamesRJamesR
    i would find another lbs - greasing the boom aint a bright thing to do.

    strongly advise anyone reading this post NOT to grease boom.
  • weldin4weldin4
    edited December 2017
    Why? What's wrong with doing that mr. lightbulb?
  • weldin4weldin4
    edited December 2017
    I did not grease the frame the service department at Richardson Bike Mart did that without asking me. They are a Terra Trike Dealer. They informed me of what they did after I went in to pick it up! So you might want to talk to them about being NOT SO BRIGHT! It did stopped the annoying creaking noise.
  • squirrelpie0squirrelpie0
    Disagree. My Rover was getting severe corrosion inside . Grease solved the problem and properly tightened it does not slip.... either before or after greasing. Creaking was more likely from loose set screws, not lack or too much grease. No movement no squeak.
  • weldin4weldin4
    edited December 2017
    My set screws were tight as all get out and I still had the noise! It wasn't until they greased the inside that it stopped. They did a proper tune up and addressed all issues I pointed out to them.
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